Videopac / Odyssey2 forum

Videopac / Odyssey2 => Hardware => Topic started by: VideopacBelgium on June 16, 2009, 12:45:43 AM



Title: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on June 16, 2009, 12:45:43 AM
Hi!
Can we add a RGB output on the G7000 same as on the G7200 ?
Thanks.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on June 16, 2009, 09:43:26 AM
Sure, if you make a PCB with the required components on it. (2 TTL IC's, a transistor and a couple of resistors and diodes.)
Only the 12V switch signal won't be available.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on June 16, 2009, 05:42:06 PM
Hi!
Thanks Ren?.
Yes I'm very interested for that.
Do you have the circuit diagram?
For the 12v switch, can I use a system with IC TL497 ? (VCC - VDD)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on June 17, 2009, 11:52:58 AM
For the 12v switch, can I use a system with IC TL497 ? (VCC - VDD)

That should be possible (5V to 12V converter), but it might not be necessary if you just switch your TV to the external input manually.

Do you have the circuit diagram?

Not really.
Take a look at the circuit diagram of the G7200.
You'll need to add the following part numbers of this diagram to your G7000:

RGB:
IC653 (74LS08), IC652 (7407),
D692, D693, D694, D695, D696, D697 (6x 1N4148),
R746, R747, R748 (3x 1k5), R735, R736, R737 (3x 560E)

Audio:
R738 (470E), R751 (100E according to diagram, but 180E might be better)

Status RGB:
R723 (47E)

Sync:
TS681 (BC548B),
R733 (4k7), R772 (4k7), R773 (680E), R774 (180E)

This mod will be RGB only, no composite video.

http://home.kpn.nl/~mdr.vd.enden/download/g7200_2.jpg (http://home.kpn.nl/~mdr.vd.enden/download/g7200_2.jpg)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 17, 2009, 01:13:46 AM
Hi Rene,
I don't understand some connect:

IC 653: Pin 2,5,9,12 must be connected to which point?

Connections IC 653 and IC 652:
IC 653 pin 11 (L) to connect to IC 652 pin 11 + pin 9 + pin 13 ?
IC 653 pin 3 (G) to connect to IC 652 pin 1 ?
IC 653 pin 6 (B) to connect to IC 652 pin 5 ?
IC 653 pin 8 (R) to connect to IC 652 pin 3 ?

Thanks.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 17, 2009, 12:32:18 PM
IC 653: Pin 2,5,9,12 must be connected to which point?

That's the blanking signal. It should be connected to pin 39 of the 8048 (or pin 8 of IC 670), but you'll need an inverter like on the schematic of the G7200.

Connections IC 653 and IC 652:
IC 653 pin 11 (L) to connect to IC 652 pin 11 + pin 9 + pin 13 ?
IC 653 pin 3 (G) to connect to IC 652 pin 1 ?
IC 653 pin 6 (B) to connect to IC 652 pin 5 ?
IC 653 pin 8 (R) to connect to IC 652 pin 3 ?

Yes, that's correct.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 21, 2009, 01:41:19 AM
Oops! the RGB PCB works but the screen scrolls from left to right...
Problem with the inverter 74LS04?

(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/SCREEN.jpg)

(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/RGB_PCB.jpg)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 21, 2009, 12:31:55 PM
Looks more like a problem with the Sync signal (the transistor circuit).


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Seob on July 21, 2009, 06:11:04 PM
nice clear font.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 21, 2009, 06:45:57 PM
Looks more like a problem with the Sync signal (the transistor circuit).

I re-checked the transistor circuit, it seems to me this is ok.
On the G7200 diagram, R733 (4k7) was connected to the pin 6 of the IC 656.
However on my RGB PCB, the resistor 4K7 was connected to the pin 11 of the IC 669 = P.6.6  (composite video) of the G7000. Is this correct?
Thanks.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 21, 2009, 11:02:24 PM
On the G7200 diagram, R733 (4k7) was connected to the pin 6 of the IC 656.
However on my RGB PCB, the resistor 4K7 was connected to the pin 11 of the IC 669 = P.6.6  (composite video) of the G7000. Is this correct?

That should be the same signal.

Maybe a silly question, but: have you switched your TV to the external input? I've seen this problem before on older TV's with an RGB input. The SCART connector has two switch signals, one for switching the TV to the external input (pin 8, 12V), and one to switch from composite video to RGB (pin 16, 2V). Because the G7000 doesn't have a 12V power supply, you probably haven't connected the signal for pin 8 of the SCART connector, but you have connected the signal for pin 16. The result is that the TV does switch to the RGB input, but not to the external input. As the Sync signal goes through the external input, you will see the RGB signal, but without sync.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Seob on July 23, 2009, 06:30:28 PM
@Videopakbelgium

Can you draw a circuit diagram of your pcb? I don't understand the diagram rene has put on the net. I want to build one as well.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 24, 2009, 02:07:32 AM
On the G7200 diagram, R733 (4k7) was connected to the pin 6 of the IC 656.
However on my RGB PCB, the resistor 4K7 was connected to the pin 11 of the IC 669 = P.6.6  (composite video) of the G7000. Is this correct?

That should be the same signal.

Maybe a silly question, but: have you switched your TV to the external input? I've seen this problem before on older TV's with an RGB input. The SCART connector has two switch signals, one for switching the TV to the external input (pin 8, 12V), and one to switch from composite video to RGB (pin 16, 2V). Because the G7000 doesn't have a 12V power supply, you probably haven't connected the signal for pin 8 of the SCART connector, but you have connected the signal for pin 16. The result is that the TV does switch to the RGB input, but not to the external input. As the Sync signal goes through the external input, you will see the RGB signal, but without sync.

I re-checked again and again ...
Finally, I find 12v on the G7000. I connect pin 8 (scart) through 1k resistor + 1N4148 to the pin 11v from the external power supply. The TV switches to RVB when I turn on the G7000 such as the G7400 .... but this is the same screen which roll and roll and roll from left to right .....


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 24, 2009, 09:13:03 PM
I think I've found the problem: there's an error in the circuit diagram of the G7200! For IC 656 they've used a NAND symbol, but in reality it is an AND gate! So if you connect the input of a free inverter to pin 11 of IC 669 of your G7000, and the output of the inverter to your transistor circuit (4k7 resistor), it should work.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 24, 2009, 11:26:50 PM
?::: P:::? ?:::E:::? ?:::R:::? ?:::F:::? ?:::E:::? ?:::C:::? ?:::T:::?

Thanks Ren?, it works !!!

(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/QUEL_JEU_RGB.jpg)
Marvellous sharp screen with RGB mod !
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/RGB_PCB_FINAL.jpg)
Sync signal from pin 11 IC 669 to the inverter IC 74LS04
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/12v_G7000.jpg)
12v on G7000 from ext. power supply


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 25, 2009, 02:17:19 AM
@Videopakbelgium

Can you draw a circuit diagram of your pcb? I don't understand the diagram rene has put on the net. I want to build one as well.

Ok, now it works, I'll draw the final circuit diagram of the rgb pcb.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 29, 2009, 01:31:51 AM
Oops! The videopac with RGB pcb has worked during four hours and the green color does not work anymore!
I checked the green wire from the scart to the rgb pcb and from the rgb pcb to the G7000, they are ok.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 29, 2009, 10:10:57 AM
Can you show a picture of how it looks on your TV screen?


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 29, 2009, 04:56:04 PM
Hi!
This is very strange!

(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/TITLE.jpg)
Intro: QUEL JEU? all colors.
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/8.jpg)
Baseball: no green background and strange colors.
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/ROBOTO.jpg)
Mr.Roboto: SELECT GAME all colors and the characters "a la Matrix" are green.
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/TURTLES.jpg)
Turtles: No green
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/40.jpg)
4 in a Row: Green dog, name HOUNDOG in green but the tiles are not green and red!


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on July 29, 2009, 09:46:07 PM
I think there is a problem with the blanking signal, because the strange colors appear when the background color is something else than black.
(IC 653 in the circuit diagram of the G7200.)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on July 31, 2009, 12:58:09 PM
Rene, you are right.
I badly connected two wire, I reversed the input with the output of the inverter 74LS04 (from blanking).... 
Now it works very well.
Thanks again for your help.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 11, 2009, 10:52:05 AM
Hi!
Now I try to add an RGB output on my old G7000/02 with the RGB pcb from a 7200.
I add a small pcb with IC 74LS04 and IC 74LS08.
The old G7000 works fine with the RF output, when I plug the DIN8 into the DIN8 socket, the G7000 freezes and reboots, the TV turns to RGB but I have a black screen with sound.
What about the switch inside the DIN8 socket on the 7200 pcb?
Thanks
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/7000RGB7200A.jpg)
http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/7000RGB7200.jpg


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on August 11, 2009, 10:26:15 PM
If the G7000 resets you've probably caused a short circuit.
The switch inside the DIN-8 socket is useless, you should remove resistor R713 (100 Ohm according to the circuit diagram).


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 12, 2009, 05:03:21 PM
@Videopakbelgium

Can you draw a circuit diagram of your pcb? I don't understand the diagram rene has put on the net. I want to build one as well.

@ Seob
Hi!
It's enough difficult to draw a circuit diagram of my pcb because the 2nd one I build is not the same as the 1st, I'm soldering each element and wire step by step. If you want I can build one for you for the price of the elements, this is not very expensive.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 12, 2009, 05:14:48 PM
@ Rene_G7400

Hi!
Is IC SN7400 the same as 74LS04 ? (as inverter for the rgb pcb)
Thanks.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on August 12, 2009, 05:38:56 PM
Is IC SN7400 the same as 74LS04 ? (as inverter for the rgb pcb)

No. You can use the SN7400 as an inverter, but the pinout is not the same.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 18, 2009, 11:48:38 PM
Hi!
Hard to find some ICs in Belgium.
Can I use one IC 74LS07 as one IC 7407 ?
Thanks.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Seob on August 19, 2009, 12:17:23 AM
What would be the cost, for building one?


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on August 19, 2009, 12:38:12 AM
Hard to find some ICs in Belgium.
Can I use one IC 74LS07 as one IC 7407 ?

The RGB output levels might not be exactly the same, but I don't think it will be a big difference.
Otherwise you can find the ICs on Ebay.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on August 19, 2009, 12:43:28 AM
Is IC SN7400 the same as 74LS04 ? (as inverter for the rgb pcb)

No. You can use the SN7400 as an inverter, but the pinout is not the same.

It would be better to use 'LS' versions, except maybe for the 7407.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 19, 2009, 10:53:05 PM
What would be the cost, for building one?

@ Seob,
It seems to me that the pcb rgb I can build (and tested) cost 23 euros with the scart cable.
+ shipping cost from Belgium to your home.
Or we can exchange for videopac game(s)?


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 19, 2009, 10:56:00 PM
If the G7000 resets you've probably caused a short circuit.
The switch inside the DIN-8 socket is useless, you should remove resistor R713 (100 Ohm according to the circuit diagram).

I remove the resistor R713 and it works!
I've a clear sharped colorfull picture with the scart on my old videopac !


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Sweersa on August 20, 2009, 05:26:44 PM
Wow that signal looks really clear.  My Odyssey 2 consoles with the RF signal looks pretty bad on my LCD 19'.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Seob on August 20, 2009, 10:43:20 PM
You can find the 74ls04 at be.farnell.com http://be.farnell.com/texas-instruments/sn74ls04n/74ls-74ls04-dip14-5-25v/dp/1106072?Ntt=74ls04 (http://be.farnell.com/texas-instruments/sn74ls04n/74ls-74ls04-dip14-5-25v/dp/1106072?Ntt=74ls04)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on August 22, 2009, 12:01:44 AM
Final RGB output on the C52/02, no attached wires, all plugs.
(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/C52_rgb.jpg)
http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/C52rgb.jpg

(http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/7000RGB7200A.jpg)
http://www.ddrbelgium.eu/7000RGB7200.jpg


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: menz666 on October 25, 2016, 05:48:07 PM
I want RGB in my G7000 too. Does anybody of you drawn a circuit diagram so i can build the RGB PCB?!

thanks in advance...

menz


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: VideopacBelgium on October 25, 2016, 10:44:00 PM
Hi!
This is the link:
http://ozyr.com/rene/Download/G7200_rgb.jpg


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: pauloandmatos on November 09, 2016, 01:42:20 PM
Hi all,

I'm Paulo, a Portuguese user new to the forum, installed my g7000 in my living room a few days ago, it has been stored since my childhood.
Dug out my old Sony trinitron crt and
recently bought from René his multicart, so everything is on track.
Next step is having the g7000 output rgb as the rf signal is very low on quality.

Can anyone help me with this?
I think I can do the final soldering to the mainboard thing but more experienced and knowledgeable hands are required to put the mod circuit together.
Is there anyone willing to do this for me, at a cost of course?

Thank you
PM


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 01, 2017, 11:03:54 PM
hi all,

thanks for this thread!

I am actually just getting to learn electronics myself but do have several years of (pcb) soldering experience.
Mainly I've just done other people's circuits/examples and am currently (finally) reading up on electronic basics and interested in learning how to use programs such as eagle so this seemed a nice project to do for my Videopac.

I think I am following this thread quite well, but get stuck when running down the list of components I need to buy, especially the resistors..

My main question is, what W value for each? If I look at a few examples on google I see several examples, all different designs and a mixture of what seems to be 0,25W and 0,6W - so rather being safe then sorry I thought I would ask before making a purchase of the parts.

Thanks in advance

Tim


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on January 01, 2017, 11:14:25 PM
0.25W is enough for all resistors in this mod.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 02, 2017, 04:05:31 PM
Great, thanks Rene, that helps a lot!

I hope you don't mind a few more questions :S

Here's the list of parts I've got so far based on previous posts, I'm planning on getting my items from Reichelt in Germany (since I use them for a lot of my C64 projects) and can combine an order.

---------------------------
Could you take a quick glance over these parts ?

RGB      
IC653   LS 08   Schottky TTL - 74LS08
      
IC652   LS 04   Schottky TTL - 74LS04
      
D692   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
D693   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
D694   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
D695   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
D696   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
D697   1N 4148   Planar Epitaxial switching diode, DO35, 100 V, 0.15 A
      
R746   1/4W 1,5K   1/4W 1,5K  :: Carbon film resistor 1/4W, 5%, 1.5 kilo-ohms
R747   1/4W 1,5K   1/4W 1,5K  :: Carbon film resistor 1/4W, 5%, 1.5 kilo-ohms
R748   1/4W 1,5K   1/4W 1,5K  :: Carbon film resistor 1/4W, 5%, 1.5 kilo-ohms
      
R735   1/4W 560   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 560 Ohms
R736   1/4W 560   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 560 Ohms
R737   1/4W 560   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 560 Ohms
      
AUDIO:      
R738   1/4W 470   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 470 ohm
      
R751   1/4W 100   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 100 ohms
but 180E might be better   1/4W 180   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 180 ohm
      
STATUS RGB:      
R723   1/4W 47   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 47 ohm
      
SYNC      
TS681   BC 548B   NPN TO-92 transistor 30 V 0.1 A 0.5 W
      
R733   1/4W 4,7K   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 4.7 kOhm
R772   1/4W 4,7K   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 4.7 kOhm
      
R773   1/4W 680   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 680 Ohms
      
R774   1/4W 180   Carbon film resistor 1/4 W, 5%, 180 ohm

BOARD      
H25PR100   Breadboard, laminated paper, 100x100 mm

---------------------------

Next, to get the 12v line for scart (as I'm really worried some of my old TV's might need it), I tried reading up on how to achieve that and several googles later, I found this part:

TMA 0512S   Traco Power DC/DC converter, TMA series, 5/12 V DC
https://www.reichelt.de/index.html?ACTION=3;ARTICLE=120444;SEARCH=TMA%200512S (https://www.reichelt.de/index.html?ACTION=3;ARTICLE=120444;SEARCH=TMA%200512S)

Would adding this simply do the trick, or is there anything to considder to add as not to mess up current etc?

---------------------------

Scart resistors?

Cable -> I already have a lot of Tasker cable here to choose from of other projects, but I'll be sure to make a final list of what I used to other's can perhaps see what I used.

SEC 20   21-pin scart plug for round cable

If I read correctly other websites.. this mod requires a straight forward pin to pin scart connection, no other resistors are required within the scart cable ?

---------------------------

And last question (sorry for asking so many) .. Connectors ?

I noticed in one of your posts elsewhere also the mention of correct DIN-8 plugs and connectors..

For C64 I would typically use horseshoe-shaped DIN8 connectors (MAS 80S and MAB 8S) which I realise would work, but would not be normal for Videopac that uses the round connector. So I assumed that (MAS 80SN and MAB 8SN) would be correct.

However then noticed a page where you mentioned a very specific board connector for the G7400; MAB-8-SH from Hirschmann. so I decided to have a look at that, since I also have two G7400 (one of mine, and one of a friend) which could do with a RGB upgrade (info's taken from your other posts)

As Reichelt does not have the MAB-8-SH I decide to go to Hirschmann's website and look at who sells their plugs, and then I discovered there are two type of MAB-8-SH.

MAB 8 SH - product number 931 399-500 
https://www.e-catalog.beldensolutions.com/link/57078-24228-256281-256282-24384-24385-24386-34517/en/conf/0
 (https://www.e-catalog.beldensolutions.com/link/57078-24228-256281-256282-24384-24385-24386-34517/en/conf/0)
Difference:
Contact bearer material PBT/UL standard 94 V-0
Housing material PBT/UL standard 94 V-0

and

MAB 8 SH - product number 931 399-200
https://www.e-catalog.beldensolutions.com/link/57078-24228-256281-256282-24384-24385-24386-39340/en/conf/0
 (https://www.e-catalog.beldensolutions.com/link/57078-24228-256281-256282-24384-24385-24386-39340/en/conf/0)
Difference:
Contact bearer material PS-I/UL standard 94 HB
Housing material PS-I/UL standard 94 HB

Will both versions work for the Videopac, or is it wiser to go for the -200 or -500 version?

And second questions related to the DIN connector.. I am now puzzled, thinking there were only 2 types or DIN-8 plug (round of horseshoe) I actually saw a thread elsewhere mentioning a third type of connector.

Which makes me wonder, if I go with the MAB 8 SH, will regular round-shaped 8-pin din plug work?
For example, MAB 8SN - DIN socket, 8-pin, circular

If that is a yes, then for the G7000 I am guessing (MAS 80SN - DIN connector, 8-pin, circular) would be the best choice so that the cables for the G74000 will match as well.
But if it is no, then I am puzzled.

thanks a lot in advance,

Tim


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 02, 2017, 09:40:44 PM
Hang on,

just thought of something.. if I send 5v to pin 8, if will sync but just jump to 16:9 format right?
in that case any tv remote should be able to switch from 16:9 to 4:3 format, so no need to provide 12v.



Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on January 02, 2017, 11:40:06 PM
Hang on,

just thought of something.. if I send 5v to pin 8, if will sync but just jump to 16:9 format right?
in that case any tv remote should be able to switch from 16:9 to 4:3 format, so no need to provide 12v.

The signal on pin 8 shouldn't be necessary anyway, you would just have to switch your TV to external input manually (with the remote control).


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on January 03, 2017, 12:05:16 AM
IC 652 = 7407 (do not use 74LS07), but you'll also need a 74LS04.

For the DIN connector it doesn't really matter which version you use (round or horse-shoe), as long as you use a matching DIN plug (obviously). There are no resistors in the SCART plug or cable. For a G7000 you don't have to use a DIN connector (it may be something else), but if you also want to use it for a G7400 then DIN would be easier (as you can use the same cable). For a DIN connector for a G7400 you might have to check the solder pins: some pins are spaced differently for some types. (Might be better to order both and see which fits best.)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 03, 2017, 01:02:20 AM
Thanks Rene!

Yes.. I realise it is not really needed.. but I want to give my cousins a G7000 as a present.. He is still young and has not been spoiled by the latest playstation of xbox, so it will be great to give them the experience of a Videopac that me and my sister had as kids :)

Point is.. I expect the phonecall from my sister saying the videopac is broken just because she doesn't know how to use a TV correctly.. so even if it would jump by default to 16:9, at least there's a higher chance it will be used and enjoyed.

OK.. and thanks for looking over the list.. darn those DIN connectors though..
I did realise I could use any socket connector for the G7000, as long as I map them correctly with a matching plug, and I did even considder removing the RF cable and using that slot directly into the box with a scart on the other end.. but since two other friends asked me to do this mod, and I have a 7400 aswell I will try to match the plugs so atleast I can do the same scart plug.

Anyhow.. the DIN connectors.. urgl.. It frustrated me so much that thanks to another website I have discovered a 3rd DIN 8 pins connector that I did not know existed, that I have now actually spent some hours on the Belden website trying to make a compatibility matrix for all their plugs/sockets with 8 pins.

I have listed all their DIN 8 connectors (without locking screw) so straight plugs, angled plugs, straight sockets and panel mounted sockets (flange, pcb-back, pcb-angled) with part numbers, links to belden website, connection type, etc.etc.etc. in excel to get a clear overview.. the only fuss I still have is over the DIN 41524 which they specify as pin/socket 1-5, which still doesn't give clarity which of their plugs/sockets are compatible for pin/socket 6,7 and 8..

So.. I just have to add the plug photo's aswell, and then I will mail the result to Belden and ask them nicely if they can confirm to get 100% certainty.

Just to be sure I will also ask them seperately if the connections on the "MAB 8 SH" types (931 399-500 and 931 399-200) are identical, which should atleast confirm it's just a material difference only since both are specified with the same "DIN 41 524 (sockets 1-5)" -> who knows.. there might be a difference in sockets 6-8..

Not really how I had hoped to spend my evening today.. BUT.. it's been furstrating me for such a long time for other machines aswell each time checking "what did I order the last time.. hmm, was it for Atari or commodore or.. oh shit.. where are those schematics again :)" that making this compatibility matrix was somehow putting a smile on my face aswell :)

I will post the final result here after I get word back from Belden.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 03, 2017, 03:44:17 AM
Just dropped a mail to Belden through their website.

www.dropbox.com/s/jaevq2zjt7ig08o/belden_connectors_din_8_matrix.xls (http://www.dropbox.com/s/jaevq2zjt7ig08o/belden_connectors_din_8_matrix.xls)

Here's the matrix on Belden's din-8 connectors so far, I have made some assumptions, but asked Belden to confirm or correct me if wrong.

Interesting enough both the "MAB 8 SH" point to u-shaped connectors, which I am guessing are 262 degree style horseshoe, which would be the same DIN8 connect as used by the Commodore 64 video/audio out.. but the G7400 I have here does not have this DIN out for video so I can not verify (I will have to do that when it arrives.)

Rene, any chance you can verify that the "MAB 8 SH" used in the G7400 RGB mod here;
http://www.the-nextlevel.com/odyssey2/articles/g7400guide/rgbmod.php (http://www.the-nextlevel.com/odyssey2/articles/g7400guide/rgbmod.php)
Is the exact same connection as the original machines produced in France?



Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Rene_G7400 on January 03, 2017, 09:31:12 AM
This seems to be a horseshoe version, so not exactly the same. Please be aware that the round version and the horseshoe version may not use the same pin numbering. In my G7400 I've used a horseshoe version. I still think it would be best to order a few different versions (only the connectors, not the plugs) and then check which fits best, and then write down which version to use for future mods. Most important is that the footprint of the connector matches the holes in the PCB of the G7400.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 03, 2017, 06:23:10 PM
Ah.. well, in that case then there's no choice.. shoehorse it is :)

I will order a handfull of circular plugs and lable "DON'T TOUCH.. ONLY FOR FR G7400 EMERGENCY :)"  .. and hide it somewhere in my supply cupboard :) just to be safe to have them if ever needed.

This hole project is really got me enthusiastic for the Videopac again :) I've actually managed to get a nice deal on two broken units (g7000 + g7400) today, picking up later in the week.. lets hope they are as "broken" as the previous one I got.. and otherwise I'm sure I'll find my way on the forum to search some wisdom posted here.

So.. as far as I can see, the only two fitting connectors to the PCB are actually both horseshoe, with same specs.. see picture below.. but I have asked Belden to confirm that..
 
(http://i.imgur.com/wl9lpBe.jpg)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 05, 2017, 07:00:21 AM
Wow.. I have spent A LOT of time on this now.. but as I am learning as I go on this little project this have been a great experience so far :) I watched a few how-to videos on Eagle CAD and have been playing around with it the last days.. as I had hoped for working on this Videopac board and copying a diagram and then making choices where to place parts etc. is really helping me understand more!

I have tried to google most stupid questions I came across along the way :) but I can't help unfortunately there are a few left (and atleast 30 I found the answer for, such as which end of an inverter is input and which is output.. hehe)

Rene, I hope you don't mind a final list of questions to help me understand?

Q1. Capacitors missing from kit list?
Whilst checking what I was doing my eye did catch 2 items within the marked red box that were not on the kit list: C852 (between +5 and GND on IC652) and C854 (top left of the marked red box).
Do I add those parts to my project list and include them in my diagram?

Q2. Dots on the box
Whilst drawing my diagram I used solderpads to be able to mark them on my board (line1, 2 etc).
Do I understand the points correctly:
LINE1 to pin27 IC 670
LINE6 -- Blanking Signal -- To inverter 74LS04N and from there to pin 39 of the 8048 (or pin 8 of IC 670)
LINE7 to pin11 IC 656
LINE3 to pin19 IC 670
LINE4 to pin20 IC 670
LINE2 to pin18 IC 670
LINE5 to pin6 IC 656 (matches confirm in previous post)

Q3. the 74LS04N, just to double check;
LINE6 (combined 74LS08N pin12, 2, 5 and 9) goes to pin 1 of 74LS04N.
Pin2 of 74LS04N then goes to pin39 of the 8048?
(i've called this 6A and 6B in my schematics for now just incase I need to alter)

Q4. And question about this part:

I think I've found the problem: there's an error in the circuit diagram of the G7200! For IC 656 they've used a NAND symbol, but in reality it is an AND gate! So if you connect the input of a free inverter to pin 11 of IC 669 of your G7000, and the output of the inverter to your transistor circuit (4k7 resistor), it should work.


lets see if I get this 100% correct, (here my lack of electronics knowledge shows, sorry)..
Do I..
- Connect pin 11 of IC 669 to pin 3 of 74LS04N
- Connect pin 4 of 74LS04N to the junction between R733 and R772 and the TS681

Q5. Removing resistor R713 and switch
- Just to be 100% sure.. no switch, and no R713, just DIN ?
So, if I add a simple on/off switch to the mains cable (i seriously hate taking the plug out and in and I'm not a big fan of sticking cartridges in a slot whilst a machine is running) it will run RGB directly right? (only manual source on tv remote needed to be set to scart input)

Q6. Missing status CVBS?
I noticed crosschecking my kitlist when done with your kitlist, and ended up with
1x 1N4148DO35-7 (D698)
1x 1k (R749)
1x 2v feed
This I assume is the composit signal that will not be used?

Q7 Diagram puzzle?
This is probably me and not being used to diagrams, but the connections between IC 653 and IC 652 are a bit confusing.. for example why does pin 3 on IC 652 show 2 lines to that large center line. I only see it going into pin 8 of IC 653, so I don't quite understand that branch in the drawing.

Q8. And the last question (I hope)
- Is it wise to disconnect RF unit, or should it remain connected? (and does the RGB board impact the RF signal in any way?) ?

oh and I have the entire schematics drawn out now. I have no idea how to share that and it's a bit large to up and a picture. Can I email you the .sch file Rene ?

Thanks
Tim


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: fazerco on January 08, 2017, 07:18:42 PM
Is there someone fabricating this so that i can put it in? Cause my skills with these things isn't good.


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 08, 2017, 08:48:10 PM

Yes, I hope to soon :)

Rene has been awesome giving me some help as I am trying to learn how to build and design a layout (sort of as a study project).. so once it is done and I know it works I will gladly share the design and make a few boards extra since I need to order parts anyhow.



Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: fazerco on January 09, 2017, 08:46:21 PM
Fantastic, write me up for one  :)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on January 09, 2017, 10:45:28 PM
:) sure I'll definately post it here, but not before I built and made so I know for sure I did not mess up :)


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: TimHarris on March 22, 2017, 03:04:02 AM
well, quick update..

unfortunately due to bad health, and later another project that ate a lot of time..
this had to wait for a while :(

the good news is that I have finally ordered a prototype PCB in china this weekend.
Excited to see if they will work, if not I will fix them and do a second run if needed.

A massive BIG THANK YOU goes to Rene!

What you don't see in this thread is that Rene has given me A LOT of feedback in the background and patiently corrected my mistakes, and actually helped me a lot trying to learn and understand basics of drawing schematics and board design in Eagle.

Many thanks Rene!!!!!



Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Unstablewarpfield on March 30, 2017, 08:21:55 PM
My modest contribution to this topic... RGB board for the Videopac G7000.

(http://www.atariage.com/forums/gallery_ips/gallery/album_1860/gallery_42511_1860_21399.jpg)

Works fantastic!


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: Carlos Bragatto on April 06, 2019, 09:07:14 PM
My modest contribution to this topic... RGB board for the Videopac G7000.

(http://www.atariage.com/forums/gallery_ips/gallery/album_1860/gallery_42511_1860_21399.jpg)

Works fantastic!


Hey man, I just moved to the UK and finally have easy access to RGB tvs. I got a Radiola Jet 471 the other day (and already got it working and connected to my TV, fantastic picture on SCART), and I just bought a Videopac G7000 today.

Are you selling this board? I'm interested in one.

Thanks

Carlos


Title: Re: RGB for G7000
Post by: grips03 on October 29, 2019, 05:21:50 PM
If still needed, I sell O2/G7000 RGB board, see here:
https://atariage.com/forums/topic/263723-odyssey-2-videopac-g7000-rgb-board-for-sale/